Relay bypass

Stompboxes circuits published in magazines, books or on DIY electronics websites.

Relay bypass

Postby Vlada » 21 Jun 2017, 19:27

Hi there guys, I'm new on this forum but I have built around 20 pedals. Still learning. This is my first post here. I heard about relay bypass switching and found few interesting schematics online. Some of them use transistors, microcontrollers, 4069 chips. Whats the main differnce beetwen microcontroler and 4069? Is it just current draw or there is something more? Also, what is your opinion on relay bypass circuits?
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby POTL » 22 Jun 2017, 02:53

Subscribe
I am also in search of answers about the operation of the bypass on the relay
I will be grateful to those who will respond in detail and share the schemes
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby Vlada » 29 Jun 2017, 10:11

Anyone?
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby Dirk_Hendrik » 29 Jun 2017, 13:36

The questions asked suggest doing some homework. The question what's the difference between a uController and a 4069 chip is too easy to find out oneself.

General opinion;
Relays use big coils to do the swithing that induce a strong electromagnetic pulse when switching. That pulse can be audible and getting rid of it can be a bitch.
Sorry. Plain out of planes.

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Re: Relay bypass

Postby POTL » 29 Jun 2017, 21:59

Dirk_Hendrik wrote:The questions asked suggest doing some homework. The question what's the difference between a uController and a 4069 chip is too easy to find out oneself.

General opinion;
Relays use big coils to do the swithing that induce a strong electromagnetic pulse when switching. That pulse can be audible and getting rid of it can be a bitch.


Many manufacturers on the contrary say that the relay helps to get rid of the click of a button and get a silent on / off switch
What you will say, there is no point in studying the relay and it's worthwhile using the true bypass
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby box » 30 Jun 2017, 14:11

Vlada wrote:Anyone?

Hi Vlada,
You can do your project with only few components.Microcontroller ATtiny85,relay Takamisawa AL5WN-K,voltage regulator 78L05, 10k---2pcs, 10 nF--2pcs,
10 uF--1pc and LED , momentary switch.
From 9V battery power consumption is ~11mA in ON status and 10.5mA in OFF.
For programming I use Arduino Uno modul with small project board.Link with more details.
http://www.hobbytronics.co.uk/arduino-attiny
True bypass switch working very well.
Rgds
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby box » 30 Jun 2017, 18:53

Hi,
Quick craft for hobbyists :) Please note :no connection between pin 4 and 5 in Atinny85. Sorry for not clear picture.
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby electrosonic » 30 Jun 2017, 19:31

That's similar to what we have started doing. I have used the attiny13a - it can even be programmed with the arduino IDE. It's only about a dozen lines of code so the inefficiency of using the arduino platform doesn't really matter.

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Re: Relay bypass

Postby POTL » 01 Jul 2017, 02:50

Heh I counted, bypass on the relay with the microcontroller goes gold and will cost 3-4 times more than usual, it's not cool
Let's discuss the relay using cmos as in the Way Huge effects
For example, on a 4069 chip
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby plush » 03 Jul 2017, 14:20

POTL wrote:Heh I counted, bypass on the relay with the microcontroller goes gold and will cost 3-4 times more than usual, it's not cool


I build mine using takamisawa na5w relays with optional optofet muting and attiny brains. It costs like a high quality 3pdt, but lasts 3-4 times longer. It's faster and silent. It pays at the end.
The only downside is the current draw. It depends on the components you use, but, in general, you don't want to use batteries in your pedals tha are equipped with a relay bypass.

POTL wrote:Let's discuss the relay using cmos as in the Way Huge effects
For example, on a 4069 chip


AFAIK, you can't implement signal muting in such non-programmable relays. They can be prone to clicking, therefore i see no sense in using them instead of 3pdts.
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby POTL » 03 Jul 2017, 22:56

I understand, thank you, then I'll leave this venture.
About 3PDT, are you familiar with Aliexpress.com?
On this site you can find these buttons (blue) for about $ 1.56
The buttons go from China, but there are no complaints, at the moment I have about a dozen waiting boards
One button I exchanged for 10 germanium transistors - Russian GT402 (analog AC128) - my friend installed this button in his pedal, works fine.
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby plush » 04 Jul 2017, 08:58

POTL wrote:I understand, thank you, then I'll leave this venture.
About 3PDT, are you familiar with Aliexpress.com?
On this site you can find these buttons (blue) for about $ 1.56
The buttons go from China, but there are no complaints, at the moment I have about a dozen waiting boards
One button I exchanged for 10 germanium transistors - Russian GT402 (analog AC128) - my friend installed this button in his pedal, works fine.


I presume, you are from Russia or SNG. So am I.

And yes, I'm familiar with Ali. I've actually ordered a lot of stuff from them.
Their 3pdts vary, depending on the manufacturer and seller. Best ones are sold directly by Daier (Yueqing Daier Electron Co., Ltd. on Aliexpress).
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby bmxguitarsbmx » 05 Jul 2017, 18:54

box wrote:
Vlada wrote:Anyone?

...
From 9V battery power consumption is ~11mA in ON status and 10.5mA in OFF.
....


You could go directly to a non-latching relay and compete with those current figures. The Omron G5V-H1-DC9 uses 16.7mA to run the coil. If you are running the effect 50% of the time, your average current consumption would be 8.35mA. The circuitry would be dead simple too. The G5-H1 series are very quiet. I use the 12V version in tube amps with zero pops. I have encountered popping with latching relays as well, which I assume to be from the velocity and tension placed by the latching mechanism.
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby Silver Blues » 06 Jul 2017, 00:48

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Re: Relay bypass

Postby chicago_mike » 06 Jul 2017, 02:36

Skyline FX 2013
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby electrosonic » 06 Jul 2017, 08:04



For what exactly?

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Re: Relay bypass

Postby Zokk » 10 Jul 2017, 20:33

There are many interesting projects at aresaudio, some of them involve true bypass with relay and signal mute, for example:
http://www.aresaudio.com/files/Picolooper-V3-schematic.jpg
I think you should be a registered user to access the "download" section, maybe the firmware is available in this section.
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby POTL » 11 Aug 2017, 02:52

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Last edited by POTL on 11 Aug 2017, 04:48, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Relay bypass

Postby POTL » 11 Aug 2017, 03:18

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