Amptweaker - Tight Metal  [traced]

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Re: amptweaker ?

Postby ggedamed » 07 Dec 2015, 08:25

Amptweaker - Tight Metal [traced]

You're kidding, right?

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Re: amptweaker ?

Postby okgb » 08 Dec 2015, 19:26

26 pages, nope not kidding thanks. the diode gate was something peavey has used before, he seemed
to make a big deal out of having the tight control, but the comments from builds don't make it interesting to me,
glad you pointed it out.
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby richard44 » 18 Dec 2015, 01:29

To the JOK3RX,
I don't know if anyone monitors this post as it's a bit old, but I wanted to thank you for your Tight Rock schematic, and detailed explanations of the conversion of the Tight Metal to Tight Rock. I was preparing to make a Tight Metal and had prepared a vero board and an enclosure, but as fate would have it, got delayed on actually building it, probably because, though the Tight Metal sounded amazing, it was way too much for my needs (I'm old school - think of a time when the sounds of Randy Rhoads and Vivian Campbell were the definition of 'Metal'). Anyway, when build time finally arrived, I found your Tight Rock schematic. From YouTube videos, the Tight Rock seemed much more suited to my tastes, so I followed your schematic and notes (from 3/16/14 and 3/15/14, respectively) and in all positions you discussed, converted my vero to a "Tight Rock" build. All I can say is, holy Christ, spot f--king on! The Tight Rock is one of the greatest pedals I've ever built. Certainly "Rock" is a misnomer. This is beyond "Rock", and even beyond what "Metal" used to be in the old days. Words are words, but the proof is in the sound - this thing nails everything from old school Van Halen to all things modern.
A few comments / questions. . .
1) Regarding the extra components in the "Tight Rock" between opamps 3 and 4, namely, the 220k parallel with the 475k/3n3. Since those parts are not in the "Tight Metal", I thought their addition would reduce gain (via the Gain Boost switch). Since the "Tight Rock" has less gain than the "Tight Metal", it seemed to me that when these components were in the circuit (switch 2 to 3), it would mitigate the gain, and when these components were bypassed (i.e., the switch connecting 1 to 2 in your schematic), it would be higher gain (like the Tight Metal). However, I found it to be exactly the opposite. Could you offer some insight? I.e., why would those components add gain?
2) I'm puzzled by the "Tight" pot. When fully rotated to 5PM, the tone just gets thinner and more trebly. Not quite what I expected there. I saw a video of James Brown demo-ing the pedal, and that pot lived up to its name. Was wondering if you, or anyone else out there, built this and had the Tight pot work as advertised. (Even without its extreme settings, set in the middle, it allows for a huge range of wonderful sounds to be had).
3) I found your "Gate" pot to be reversed (unless I somehow wired it incorrectly originally).
I'm sure any faults are mine, but was wondering if you or anyone else could share insights or experiences with this build.
Thanks again to the JOK3RX for an incredible option to the Tight Metal,
Richard
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby J0K3RX » 19 Dec 2015, 06:54

richard44 wrote:To the JOK3RX,
I don't know if anyone monitors this post as it's a bit old, but I wanted to thank you for your Tight Rock schematic, and detailed explanations of the conversion of the Tight Metal to Tight Rock. I was preparing to make a Tight Metal and had prepared a vero board and an enclosure, but as fate would have it, got delayed on actually building it, probably because, though the Tight Metal sounded amazing, it was way too much for my needs (I'm old school - think of a time when the sounds of Randy Rhoads and Vivian Campbell were the definition of 'Metal'). Anyway, when build time finally arrived, I found your Tight Rock schematic. From YouTube videos, the Tight Rock seemed much more suited to my tastes, so I followed your schematic and notes (from 3/16/14 and 3/15/14, respectively) and in all positions you discussed, converted my vero to a "Tight Rock" build. All I can say is, holy Christ, spot f--king on! The Tight Rock is one of the greatest pedals I've ever built. Certainly "Rock" is a misnomer. This is beyond "Rock", and even beyond what "Metal" used to be in the old days. Words are words, but the proof is in the sound - this thing nails everything from old school Van Halen to all things modern.
A few comments / questions. . .
1) Regarding the extra components in the "Tight Rock" between opamps 3 and 4, namely, the 220k parallel with the 475k/3n3. Since those parts are not in the "Tight Metal", I thought their addition would reduce gain (via the Gain Boost switch). Since the "Tight Rock" has less gain than the "Tight Metal", it seemed to me that when these components were in the circuit (switch 2 to 3), it would mitigate the gain, and when these components were bypassed (i.e., the switch connecting 1 to 2 in your schematic), it would be higher gain (like the Tight Metal). However, I found it to be exactly the opposite. Could you offer some insight? I.e., why would those components add gain?
2) I'm puzzled by the "Tight" pot. When fully rotated to 5PM, the tone just gets thinner and more trebly. Not quite what I expected there. I saw a video of James Brown demo-ing the pedal, and that pot lived up to its name. Was wondering if you, or anyone else out there, built this and had the Tight pot work as advertised. (Even without its extreme settings, set in the middle, it allows for a huge range of wonderful sounds to be had).
3) I found your "Gate" pot to be reversed (unless I somehow wired it incorrectly originally).
I'm sure any faults are mine, but was wondering if you or anyone else could share insights or experiences with this build.
Thanks again to the JOK3RX for an incredible option to the Tight Metal,
Richard


Richard,

Well, it's another misnomer that the "Tight Rock" has less gain than the Tight Metal! I have owned both and I can tell you that with confidence... Over all I actually prefer the TR over the TM but they both have their places. As for the gain boost switch I am not really sure why they are in parallel? I need to get the Tight Rock back up on my bench ( I still have it in pieces) so I can go back over that part again. I had a hard time with that little area when tracing since some of the traces disappeared under the micro switch on the board. The traces are confusing as hell on these pedals and I kinda got as much of it done to satisfy myself that it was indeed almost identical to the TM with the exception of a few minor component value differences. I leave mine with the boost on all of the time and that is essentially bypassing those two resistors and the 3.3n cap which in turn is just like the TM configuration... I know what you mean about the "Tight" pot and I can tell you that it works exactly the same on the retail amptweaker pedals, and I hate it! I don't know how that is supposed to be making anything tighter? It should be called the thin chocked out knob if anything and again it works the exact same on the actual amptweaker pedals. I have heard many players say they don't like it and never turn that knob, leave it completely dialed down all the time. That feature could be left out in my opinion since the pedals are already just about as tight as tight can be! It's like adding water to water to make it more wet... :roll: Not sure about the reverse pot on the gate? It's possible on some of the earlier layouts.. In any case, that's very easily corrected. I am not a real big fan of the gate as it seems to cut some sustain and edge off the notes but it works very well with palm mutes and chuggin rhythms etc.. I can't stand the gate as it is on amptweaker pedals with it gradually increasing with the turning of the gain pot! The gate in the max position absolutely kills the tone and sustain and needs to be independent of the gain control! In my opinion it's only useable in the very very lowest levels where it gates enough of the noise to make the sound quieter but right on the edge if ya know what I mean. The dual gang gain/gate pot is a cool idea but it has to work.. As it stands I don't like it, if it worked like a Decimator then I would probably like it a lot, but it doesn't and honestly I don't expect it to.. With it independent/separate from the gain control I can get it dialed in to be almost silent without sucking too much life outa the overall sound and tone... If I were going to have something like this pedal on a "Pro" rig I would use a Decimator!

Glad you like the pedal and I agree, anybody will be hard pressed to find a more neck breaking bad ass pedal!! I use a tube screamer to some extent in front of nearly every high gain pedal with the exception of the TR and the TM! It's like it has a tube screamer built right into it!

~ Jim

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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby richard44 » 19 Dec 2015, 16:50

Hi Jim,

Thanks for the response and clarification. Since building this pedal I cannot keep my hands off it, and funny thing, I arrived at exactly the same conclusions you did: 1) only dial enough Gate to get rid of the extreme noise; 2) keep the Tight dialed down really low, 3) leave the gain boost on at all times. I am happy to hear that the Tight controls act the same on the original pedals (which means I did not screw something up). I have not yet tried running this at 18V, but James Brown in his demo showed it gave the pedal a more expansive, less compressed sound. Apropos to that, if I had to build this pedal again, I might add a 18V/9V switch with a voltage double in the circuit. I have not yet build such a doubler circuit, but found a layout using an ICL7660S with a few caps, so will give it a try in my next build. I'm sure you have you experimented with running things at 18V (when the circuit's components permit of course). Would there be an impact in sound using a real 18V power source as opposed to a 9V power source doubled to 18V (or more exactly 17-ish) with an ICL7660S ?

I really appreciate your posts - I'm learning a lot (and kicking a lot of ass along the way!).

Cheers,
Richard

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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby wee78 » 13 Jan 2016, 10:12

Hi,
I am a beginner, look at this layout very interesting. :applause:
I will build Double Dragon 18v tonight.
Can I ask what is the loop (send & return) :?: and is it Double Dragon is at the back ? is it Dragon Armor is in the different loop area :?: :hmmm:
Anyway I am very grateful J0K3RX and bajaman :thumbsup
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby J0K3RX » 21 Jan 2016, 16:18

Lookie what I stumbled across today... 8) Amptweaker Jr. Series, aren't they cute... :roll:

http://www.amptweaker.com/page/JR-Serie ... r-116.aspx

Image

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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby exm » 11 Feb 2016, 09:45

Hi J0K3RX!
What a booster is used in your pedals? What is the scheme?

Image

Or something I do not understand ...
I'm sorry for the bad english, I'm using Google Translate.
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby karul » 15 Feb 2016, 19:08

J0K3RX wrote:
Nicht Bernd wrote:JOK3RX, what kind of booster do you use, before or after Tight Metal?

Not really a booster... just low and high gain. Low is a 500k resistor across the gain pot and boost switch on removes it.

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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby exm » 15 Feb 2016, 19:58

karul wrote:
J0K3RX wrote:
Nicht Bernd wrote:JOK3RX, what kind of booster do you use, before or after Tight Metal?

Not really a booster... just low and high gain. Low is a 500k resistor across the gain pot and boost switch on removes it.

karul thanx!
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby karul » 17 Feb 2016, 16:38

exm, on page 15, you can find a couple of posts from JOK3RX, with detailed explanation, about the mods and cab simulator

J0K3RX wrote:I did a couple mods as you may or may not have noticed.. I added a boost switch which is really not a boost at all but acts like one. Ok, I will explain.. I added the 2nd stomp switch which does nothing more than throw 500k resistor across the gain pot in parallel so when engaged lowers the gain to 250k as if you had the gain half way up. I also used the other lugs on the stomp switch to bypass the gate at the same time when it's on low gain and the other lugs turn on/off the LED.. Pretty cool huh? I wired the LED so it's on when in full gain mode and off when the resistor is in parallel with the gain pot.. I find this a very useful feature and by the way with the gate off you get a bit more bite/gain anyway so it's still brutal as hell! Good for hard tight rhythm and if you roll the volume back on your guitar it really cleans up excellent!! Must have in my book if yer gonna play live with it! The other mod is the cab simulator and it's wired so it's on all the time meaning the power is applied all the time... Doesn't affect the regular output and the regular output doesn't affect the cab sim... So, you just go out of the cab sim and that's it, done! One good thing about it this way is that if you put the pedal into bypass mode and you're running out of the cab sim jack the cab sim is still on.. So you can use this as a stand alone cab sim if you want! if you have another dirt pedal like the Triple Wreck in front of the TM pedal it can also use the same cab simulation... Also you can probably run out of the cab sim to a mixer board direct and at the same time run out of the standard output to a power amp or whatever.. cool! :twisted:
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby wee78 » 03 Mar 2016, 09:20

I finished Double Dragon 18v!!! But ..... :scratch: it does not sound like heavy metal sound? A little disappointed. Also try too TLC2262, jrc4558, jrc4559, .... TLC2274 ..but not like J0K3RX MP3 sound .. :cry: Anyone build Double Dragon 18v..Please ..help!!! :(
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby J0K3RX » 03 Mar 2016, 14:46

Wee78, did you use the updated layout from brejna? Gut shots would be nice also detailed hi res if possible...
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby wee78 » 26 Apr 2016, 08:16

Hi, J0K3RX
Yes I use brejna new layout. Now the padel is work :) Can be heard metal sound. :thumbsup
Thank JOK3RK!!!

https://youtu.be/yz_unbUp8ao
Share my videos. :oops:
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby rcustoms » 23 May 2016, 02:53

some mod to have the best of both worlds
board tight rock and metal.jpg
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http://www.rcustomspedals.blogspot.com
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby Nicht Bernd » 04 Jun 2016, 14:10

@rccustoms
on witch page is your layout for Amptweaker pcb?
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby rcustoms » 07 Jun 2016, 05:34

Nicht Bernd wrote:@rccustoms
on witch page is your layout for Amptweaker pcb?

page 14
http://www.rcustomspedals.blogspot.com
guitars,pedals and amps.
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby ringworm » 18 Jun 2016, 08:46

I'm building this up from DimbuGG's 'Tight-Ass' layout on p26.
On the layout there are three blank capacitor slots between pins 1 & 2 on IC2 & 3 and pin 6,7 on IC1. Are these optional slots for small pF capacitors to reduce oscillation/noise?
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby DimebuGG » 19 Jun 2016, 21:52

ringworm wrote:I'm building this up from DimbuGG's 'Tight-Ass' layout on p26.
On the layout there are three blank capacitor slots between pins 1 & 2 on IC2 & 3 and pin 6,7 on IC1. Are these optional slots for small pF capacitors to reduce oscillation/noise?


You can leave it without worrying against noise or oscillations.
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Re: Amptweaker - Tight Metal

Postby ringworm » 20 Jun 2016, 09:27

Thanks! Will do.
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