Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund)  [traced]

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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby Dr Tony Balls » 19 Sep 2012, 14:28

From a cursory glance that looks about right to me.
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby Taller76 » 23 Jan 2013, 05:25

BaldPaul wrote:File unavailable. What gives?


Would really enjoy (all) the original docs that were posted...anyone care to re-post them?

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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby fakcior » 23 Jan 2013, 14:15

You can check DARKSIDE project at madbean's.

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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby MWichni » 23 Jan 2013, 14:44

Here's what I've got:
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby silverface » 23 Jan 2013, 21:23

And this
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby MWichni » 10 Jan 2015, 16:24

Hi guys. Try out bat43 and bat85 in clipping stages. I have just tried G-2 out with all bat43 and it sounds just great, much overdrive and headroom.
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby andymanicy » 23 Aug 2015, 08:38

Fantastic work all round, and a huge thanks to everyone involved in this. Very interesting to see inside!

I have a question regarding the Ceramic and Sybatit caps in positions C3 and C7 on both buffer circuits;

What are these doing? Why the need to use these types of caps?

Thanks guys!
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby Dirk_Hendrik » 23 Aug 2015, 10:50

Although the type of cap can have influence in the behaviour of a circuit that's virtually not the case in this circuit.
I was pretty certain that, when tracing this pedal, there would be a lot of questions on the type, brand aor whatsoever of the components used. Many assume that ages were spent on selecting the right component in each position. To limit these quastions I recorded whatever I could. After that it's up to the user of the schematic to decide what to do with this information.

I pretty much had the feeling Cornisch just uses average components sourced from places like RS or Farnell and does not want to rely on mojo stuff. Cannot blame him. Other than that a lot of the Cornus quality is in the mechanical ruggedness of his builds. I consisdered it pretty interesting to see that the forst spinoffs of this project kept referring to the Cornish pedal but discarded this mechanical aspect completely.
Example? here: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=24821
Sorry. Plain out of planes.

http://www.dirk-hendrik.com
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby StratWiz » 23 Aug 2015, 21:15

I can tell you for sure, that at least one type of components that I tried has a huge impact on the sound, and that's the germanium diodes. I tried about 30 different types and manufacturers, until I settled on the set that pleased my ears the most. You can listen to them at:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zuAAShGnB ... e=youtu.be
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby ToneKarma » 26 Aug 2015, 12:16

Dirk_Hendrik wrote:Although the type of cap can have influence in the behaviour of a circuit that's virtually not the case in this circuit.
I was pretty certain that, when tracing this pedal, there would be a lot of questions on the type, brand aor whatsoever of the components used. Many assume that ages were spent on selecting the right component in each position. To limit these quastions I recorded whatever I could. After that it's up to the user of the schematic to decide what to do with this information.

I pretty much had the feeling Cornisch just uses average components sourced from places like RS or Farnell and does not want to rely on mojo stuff. Cannot blame him. Other than that a lot of the Cornus quality is in the mechanical ruggedness of his builds. I consisdered it pretty interesting to see that the forst spinoffs of this project kept referring to the Cornish pedal but discarded this mechanical aspect completely.
Example? here: http://freestompboxes.org/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=24821


Hello DH,
I know it´s a the eternal discussion ... I have no doubts that you did a 100% job tracing this pedal.
I also agree with you on Pete´s choice of generic component sources for his pedals, but are you also sure in regards of the diodes for the G2?

I think Pete Cornish is using NOS Ge Diodes (which are available...), as I have been so far completely unsuccessful to find "proper" sounding diodes and I know I am not alone in this quest. This is also the reason (and being a bit lazy :wink: ) why I have put this project "on ice", in the closet and therefore forgot about it a little bit for the past, but it is definitely a question and a task (i.e. to find the "proper" diodes) that still haunts me a bit and I feel I should reactivate this search again as I am convinced that there is a solution ...
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby andymanicy » 27 Aug 2015, 10:36

ToneKarma wrote:
Dirk_Hendrik wrote:Although the type of cap can have influence in the behaviour of a circuit that's virtually not the case in this circuit.
I was pretty certain that, when tracing this pedal, there would be a lot of questions on the type, brand aor whatsoever of the components used. Many assume that ages were spent on selecting the right component in each position. To limit these quastions I recorded whatever I could. After that it's up to the user of the schematic to decide what to do with this information.

I pretty much had the feeling Cornisch just uses average components sourced from places like RS or Farnell and does not want to rely on mojo stuff. Cannot blame him. Other than that a lot of the Cornus quality is in the mechanical ruggedness of his builds. I consisdered it pretty interesting to see that the forst spinoffs of this project kept referring to the Cornish pedal but discarded this mechanical aspect completely.
Example? here: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=24821


Hello DH,
I know it´s a the eternal discussion ... I have no doubts that you did a 100% job tracing this pedal.
I also agree with you on Pete´s choice of generic component sources for his pedals, but are you also sure in regards of the diodes for the G2?

I think Pete Cornish is using NOS Ge Diodes (which are available...), as I have been so far completely unsuccessful to find "proper" sounding diodes and I know I am not alone in this quest. This is also the reason (and being a bit lazy :wink: ) why I have put this project "on ice", in the closet and therefore forgot about it a little bit for the past, but it is definitely a question and a task (i.e. to find the "proper" diodes) that still haunts me a bit and I feel I should reactivate this search again as I am convinced that there is a solution ...


I agree with the above. It seems the job is at 98% - but without knowing what those diodes are, our G2 clones will never sound as they should! Dirk, Is it worth a re-visit? Possibly a de-solder to measure the diodes?
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby peterw » 31 Aug 2015, 20:11

StratWiz wrote:I can tell you for sure, that at least one type of components that I tried has a huge impact on the sound, and that's the germanium diodes. I tried about 30 different types and manufacturers, until I settled on the set that pleased my ears the most. You can listen to them at:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zuAAShGnB ... e=youtu.be


Interesting, that video does sound nice :) Which diodes did you settle on?
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby modman » 31 Aug 2015, 21:21

andymanicy wrote:
ToneKarma wrote:
Dirk_Hendrik wrote:I pretty much had the feeling Cornisch just uses average components sourced from places like RS or Farnell and does not want to rely on mojo stuff. Cannot blame him. Other than that a lot of the Cornus quality is in the mechanical ruggedness of his builds. I consisdered it pretty interesting to see that the forst spinoffs of this project kept referring to the Cornish pedal but discarded this mechanical aspect completely.
Example? here: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=24821

Hello DH,
I know it´s a the eternal discussion ... I have no doubts that you did a 100% job tracing this pedal.
I also agree with you on Pete´s choice of generic component sources for his pedals, but are you also sure in regards of the diodes for the G2?
I think Pete Cornish is using NOS Ge Diodes (which are available...), as I have been so far completely unsuccessful to find "proper" sounding diodes and I know I am not aone in this quest. This is also the reason (and being a bit lazy :wink: ) why I have put this project "on ice", in the closet and therefore forgot about it a little bit for the past, but it is definitely a question and a task (i.e. to find the "proper" diodes) that still haunts me a bit and I feel I should reactivate this search again as I am convinced that there is a solution ...

I agree with the above. It seems the job is at 98% - but without knowing what those diodes are, our G2 clones will never sound as they should! Dirk, Is it worth a re-visit? Possibly a de-solder to measure the diodes?

If you guys are so keen on knowing the diode type, why don't you buy a unit and try to uncover the secret. Be sure to share pictures on your favorite forum, er ... I mean on freestompboxes. This is in fact a tracing thread, and all contributions focused uncovering the circuit. You can come with information about the diodes, you cannot poke other members to find the solution to your questions. DIY, remember?
"The whole point of diy is diy. It's not dsoiyathodtr - do some of it yourself and then have others do the rest" (paulc)

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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby peterw » 02 Sep 2015, 08:19

modman wrote:If you guys are so keen on knowing the diode type, why don't you buy a unit and try to uncover the secret. Be sure to share pictures on your favorite forum, er ... I mean on freestompboxes. This is in fact a tracing thread, and all contributions focused uncovering the circuit. You can come with information about the diodes, you cannot poke other members to find the solution to your questions. DIY, remember?


Haha, it was in fact my G-2 pedal that was traced by DirkHendrik some time ago! I brought it to him personally, so what more can I do ... :)

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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby luix » 20 Sep 2015, 22:19

you have to find germanium diodes with the same voltage drop of a silicon diode, if not the junction shut off and no soud comes out at all.

even mr. Cornish cannot break the phisic laws!
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby Dirk_Hendrik » 21 Sep 2015, 14:24

andymanicy wrote:I agree with the above. It seems the job is at 98% - but without knowing what those diodes are, our G2 clones will never sound as they should! Dirk, Is it worth a re-visit? Possibly a de-solder to measure the diodes?



Sigh....

quote from ages ago:

Dirk_Hendrik wrote:
MWichni wrote:No, I just can reach the sound (maybe as you said the amp is the cause or something else)... That's all.
It would be good to know diode types or even leakage.


approx 220mV
Type cannot be determined. Said that already. The paint... remember ;)
Sorry. Plain out of planes.

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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby StratWiz » 21 Sep 2015, 20:17

Based on my experience, of trying out tens different diodes of different manufacturers and models, these diodes have huge effect on the sound, and even the same model diodes made by different manufacturers sounds differently. So, Vf by itself is insufficient to characterize them. The way I see it, there are a few ways to go here.
1. Work on a new unit, hoping to be able to keep the paint & identify the diodes.
2. Use your own ears, just like I did, and identify diodes that best pleased your ear. Just like I did (e.g. plain sound without any modulation yet):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuAAShGnBL4

There are of course other ways to go by probably unlikely.
3. More extensively characterizing the prior ones worked on. (Vf by itself is insufficient)
4. Ask Mr. Cornish what he used :)

I believe Mr. Cornish use COTS products, but after running my tests, I am pretty sure that he extensively consulted with his clients got their feedback and picked the particular COTS diodes type the created the magic... He has access to some of the best equipment & ears on earth, I would not underestimate his skills either. Those diodes were NOT just selected coincidentally since they just happened to be available COTS...

Have fun,
SW
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby Dirk_Hendrik » 22 Sep 2015, 12:42

Stratwizz,

Could you please be so kind to do what you did in 2011?

Be gone that is.
Instead of sharing your unfounded and definitely unasked "wisdom" and presenting yourself as an expert.
In 2011 you showed yourself the biggest PITA Troll encoundeterd in this forum in years, not adding, giving or offering anything but being full of critisism on the G2 project and it seems you're startinfg the same role again.

If you know all so well, take action according to your own suggestions, instead of trolling.

Thanks

And for the latecomers who (again?) wonder why D_H is so rude?
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=11263&p=135594#p135594
Sorry. Plain out of planes.

http://www.dirk-hendrik.com

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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby StratWiz » 22 Sep 2015, 21:11

DH, you are correct, you are rude!
Don't try to patronize anyone just because you did some nice tracing work, and don't try to block people from making constructive progress beyond your capabilities.
Unlike you, I was able to actually build a great G2, in spite of the lack of information, and I also helped other people to make progress. Here's a little proof:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuAAShGnBL4
We share different views on Mr. Cornish's skills, on how critical are these diodes to the overall sound, and on how to find great sounding diodes. That's OK.
But, if you feel offended by that then perhaps you should consider getting yourself a shrink.
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Re: Cornish G2 - Guts, Schematic, Layout (from Tracer's Fund

Postby mojah63 » 08 Oct 2015, 00:36

StratWiz wrote:DH, you are correct, you are rude!
Don't try to patronize anyone just because you did some nice tracing work, and don't try to block people from making constructive progress beyond your capabilities.
Unlike you, I was able to actually build a great G2, in spite of the lack of information, and I also helped other people to make progress. Here's a little proof:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuAAShGnBL4
We share different views on Mr. Cornish's skills, on how critical are these diodes to the overall sound, and on how to find great sounding diodes. That's OK.
But, if you feel offended by that then perhaps you should consider getting yourself a shrink.
StratWiz


Post ur diodes or shut the F**ck Up already! We've been waiting since 2011...

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